Saturday, June 19, 2010

Analyzing the Fantasy: Cruelty and Torment

There's often a male submissive fantasy of serving a woman that is quite cruel, inflicting many forms of suffering, humiliation, and torment upon the sub.  In reality, this scenario rarely surfaces amongst Femdom couples (although it does happen, the percentage of written fantasies tends to be overshadowed by the percentage of couples actually doing this). 

For this topic, I will simply try to answer the question, why is it this way?

From a submissive perspective, while they may wish for this, it's unlikely that a submissive could truly handle it on a 24-7 scale.  A few hours?  Sure.  A weekend?  Definitely.  Every day for two years?  Not as easy to answer.  I give this one the mark of "fantasy and penis biting off more than they could chew."  While it's possible in small doses, 99% of males simply aren't emotionally prepared for something like this to actually happen.  Without pleasure, emotional and sexual gratification, and a worthwhile sense of self, the sub would likely either cease to exist as a person or become unhappy and rebel against his Domme.

The Domme side of things is a bit more complicated.

The first thing that comes to mind as to why there aren't a lot of Dommes out there that tend to carry this disposition full-time is that it just doesn't offer a lot to many women.  I can understand why a woman would want a sex slave for pleasure, I can understand why a woman would want a sub male for domestic chores, and I can understand why a woman would want a man who is completely devoted to her and responsive to her every whim.  These things provide tangible, pleasurable results, in addition to the knowledge that there is a man out there who exists merely to give her those pleasurable results.

The second thing I can think of is that there aren't many people out there with natural impulses to inflict suffering.  A weekend of teasing, humiliation, and suffering requires significant planning and the ability to make on the fly adjustments as needed that remain consistent with that theme.  Unless that really "does it" for her, there isn't a lot of motivation for a Domme to go to those lengths.  Similarly, if/when the unexpected occurs, will she be able to react quickly and naturally in a purely cruel way?  I believe it takes a certain personality type to really enjoy this and I don't think it's a very common one.

Delving into fetishes gets things a bit closer.  A Domme may have a fetish for spanking or inflicting pain in a sadistic way.  This I can understand a bit since it's a tangible activity yielding a specific result.  On the other hand, bondage is a little bit closer.  Having a sub bound and helpless does bring up feelings of power and control and it's also a matter of taking away his freedom to increase her pleasure.  I believe Dommes who really enjoy strict bondage are of the right nature to be cruel.

So what about this makes things appealing to these Dommes?  A few things I can come up with:
1. Knowledge that he willingly suffers for her pleasure - devotion.
2. Feelings of power and control.
3. Feeling playful and naughty.
4. It gets her off.

I have a feeling that number four is probably the great separating point between "these types" of Dommes and Dommes that don't have a lot of interest in cruelty.  I could be wrong, but that's about the only explanation I could find for a Domme dressing her sub up in a maid's outfit while locked in chastity and forced to humiliate himself in front of her.  Something about his suffering and discomfort has to make her tick on a deep level or she probably wouldn't do it.

I find this difference rather intriguing as certain scenarios will have one Domme hissing "YESSSSS, MOOOORE!" while the same scenario will leave many Dommes shaking their head saying "Nope, doesn't do it for me."

I know guilt probably plays a big part while a Domme is developing in terms of how cruel she can be while completely enjoying it.  As long as she truly values her pleasure over his comfort that avenue can be explored thoroughly without hesitation.  I believe it's probably more likely for a woman to enjoy being cruel if her early experiences with domination were with men that she didn't love nor seriously care about.

Any thoughts?


  1. I think the answer to your question has something to with the fact that, while submissive fantasies are rooted in real (and powerful) emotions, they are simply not meant to be lived out 24/7. That's like saying, "because I crave Wendy's hamburgers sometimes, I'm going to start living at Wendy's."

    A sissy acting out a fantasy is one thing, but a man living as a sissy permanently is another. At that point, you would have to stop and question the sissy's, or sub's, motivations. What does he get out of it? Is it healthy, or is it just self-indulgent?

    Don't get me wrong, I think being a sissy is a great fantasy for men to explore, but I cringe at the thought of doing it full-time. Maybe the reason people don't enjoy it 24/7 is because it's simply not rewarding. People just can't sustain that kind of give and take over a long period of time.

  2. Thank you very much for the comments.

    I agree completely with the male fantasies not meant for 24-7 living. I have done quite a bit of writing on that in previous entries (from March or April, I believe). I will admit that I wrote 75% of this post one evening and then finished it last night and I had sort of lost my train of thought with where I was going originally.

    With this post I was thinking a lot about the fantasy of men craving that super cruel, permanently angry Mistress that makes everything in their life difficult.

    I think a male sub's motivations are usually pretty simple, they want situations that turn them on and get them off in their fantasies. Many/most of these aren't feasible for them emotionally (nor physically) in the long run. This is where I think the personality of the Domme comes into play.

    If a man wishes to be forced into being a sissy until he cums (usually craving an immediate return to male life afterward), the easiest way to derail that fantasy would be to keep him as a sissy after cumming or not letting him cum at all.

    I don't think there are a lot of Dommes out there that want to drag things out to the point where he finds it completely unpleasant... but there are some Dommes out there that aren't very interested in things until they become unpleasant.

    It's that latter category that pique my interest the most.

  3. I can't really speak on the "sissy" aspect of this entry, as my husband is not in that category, but as for a Domme's perspective on the 24/7 concept, I can say a few words.

    I agree with you and anonymous that 24/7 is more in the realm of fantasy than reality, and is a term often misused by people describing their relationships. My relationship and that of many other couples) with my husband could be considered 24/7 in the sense that his submission is always available as well as my dominance, but that's not to say we actually practice the D/s every hour of every day, and that's not what you're talking about.

    A true 24/7, with a cruel mistress dominating and torturing a helpless slave is something quite different. I've read of the existence of such a thing (the late Ingrid Bellamare for one) but I guess I'd have to see it to believe it.

    As for a Dom enjoying her sub's discomfort and even pain, well mea culpa, at least some of the time (certainly not 24/7, except for those special slave weekends that my husband craves:)). Does that make me one of those cruel, heartless mistresses you're talking about? I suppose that's not for me to say, but in your list of four things that make such behavior appealing, I'd say yes to all four. But I don't have a spanking fetish or a cruelty fetish, or any other fetish, unless you want to consider dominance itself a fetish. I enjoy certain things on an irregular basis, but I still can't imagine doing anything 24/7 for an extended period.

  4. Lady Grey,

    The sissy aspect was only mean to be an example. Another example might be keeping a sub's hands bound behind his back (or chained to his balls) for a day but still putting him through his usual tasks just to make things more difficult (and not as punishment).

    If a Domme were to do this to her sub, it wouldn't be to improve his (short term) service as that would obviously be lacking that day, it probably wouldn't enhance his attractiveness, etc. While it might be done for training purposes and mental conditioning, what about when something like that is implemented after he has been trained and conditioned?

    Since I don't see an outward appeal I believe the answer is probably along the lines of "she enjoys it." By "it," I would guess it is in reference to the physical struggles and mental anguish of the sub. In my opinion, it takes a rather specific personality type to enjoy his struggles and anguish.

    You find little if any reference to these types of situations in many of the "submissive husband introduces FLR ideas to his wife" couples, since I doubt those scenarios "do it" for her, or at least she hasn't accepted the pleasure yet without guilt. I feel that characteristic really makes some Dommes very unique.

    I don't believe that someone has to be heartless to be cruel. In most cases, a cruel Mistress will probably love her long-term sub very much, especially if she is willing to put him through the ringer (knowing full well the both of them will remember this in hindsight).

    I guess what I'm leaning towards is that I think it takes a unique kind of Domme to take pleasure in locking her sub in a cage or a closet for several hours for no reason other than her own pleasure.

    Does that make any sense?

    As for 24/7...
    I once read a great definition of 24/7.
    "24/7 is not Femdom all the time. 24/7 is Femdom at any time."

    I basically view a 24/7 Femdom relationship as a relationship where the male adheres to a set of rules for duties, conduct, behavior, and ritual on a daily basis.

  5. I do think that there is a big difference between a "natural" Dom and one who is pushed or cajoled or even "hinted" into a FLR by her partner. You're very correct in saying that these newly created Doms don't usually fall into the "because I like it" category ("she enjoys it" as you say). This causes great frustration in the male sub who really, really, really wants her to enjoy it, and reading the blogs of such male subs only reinforces this opinion. They ( the subs) usually go to great lengths to assure the reader and themselves that they're not doing their sub thing for their own benefit, but mainly because it's "all for her". I won't even go into how self delusional that usually is, but suffice it to say that such reasoning simply doesn't convince me. Even the most honest of these writers - the ones who actually admit that they wouldn't be subs in a vaccuum of indifference on the part of the Dom - have a hard time admitting that it certainly isn't all about her.

    I don't think there's anything wrong with a male sub expecting to get something important for himself out of a D/s relationship. I don't understand this constant insistence that they're doing it all for their Dom. And, for me at least, it makes me quite happy to occasionally put my sub husband through uncomfortable physical and/ or mental situations simply because I enjoy it. My enjoyment doesn't preclude his enjoyment, if it exists, but it doesn't rely on it. Either way, the important thing for me is that I enjoy it, and that he's well trained enough to obey my orders. That, in a nutshell, is the basic difference between a natural Dom and a Dom who has become a Dom because her husband/partner wanted her to. The latter has a hard time imagining her husband enjoying any discomfort she puts him through, and is often loath to give him what he wants or needs. The natural Dom understands that her sub wants to be there, or needs to be there, and is perfectly content to put him through any paces that amuse her.

    Punishment is a different story, of course, but I see nothing wrong with a symbiotic D/s relationship. Indeed, I feel that's the best type of all. I can be heartless and cruel by making things more difficult for my sub, but if that's also a turn on for my sub, what's the harm? I think what you call a "unique" Dom is really just a natural Dom strutting her stuff. She's undoubtedly got a natural sub under her control, so everybody's happy, even if one of them is in a great deal of discomfort.

    By the way, I love that definition of 24/7 you mentioned.

  6. I'm glad you liked that definition of 24/7. It was the best I had heard and I committed it to memory.

    I think that sub's naturally recoil at the idea that they are doing things for themselves. I believe it's a stigma created by many of the dabblers/fakers. Most Dommes I know that have profiles on public BDSM sites tend to get flooded non-stop by people claiming to be subs/slaves but would better be described as bottoms. They want the kinky and sexual aspects of the BDSM lifestyle without the sacrifice and devotion of being an actual submissive. People who view themselves as being "truly submissive" then go out of their way to separate themselves.

    I can be as honest as I can be and that is:
    I wouldn't be in this lifestyle if it didn't get me off. As much as my ideals would hope to be solely about her, I have never actualized those ideals in my performance. I do feel guilty sometimes for things being that way.

    I agree with your ideas on the natural Domme vs. the pressured Domme.

    I agree with everything you said in your last full paragraph. I think what I was trying to uncover in the base post was why it's such a turn-on for many subs when a Domme is cruel.

    The greater the mind fuck, the more distress I am put through (especially in my mind), the more submissive I feel, the more at peace I feel in my soul, the happier I am and the more I love my Mistress.

    It takes a particular thought process to really make my skin crawl (in a good way). That "one step ahead" and "I can turn your pleasure into discomfort" type of killer instinct that is quite uncommon. When I posted the "hands chained to his waist while dusting high shelves" situation in the comments on one of your post and you made the "no way, chained to his balls," that definitely showed that instinct.

    I think it's very special.