Tuesday, November 16, 2010

Haunting Thought: Special Cruelty

Queen Goddess at the blog I am Her Maine sub posted a recounting of sissifying her husband.

If you've read a lot of my posts since I started you probably know I have a great appreciation for mind-fucking and that "killer instinct" that a Domme has towards dominating her sub.  A few weeks ago I was reading one of the posts there and came upon this paragraph describing their first public outing (driving around).

I have quoted it here:
"The closer we got the more she fidgeted. I have to admit that she was pretty passable from afar and I felt pretty comfortable but poor little Daphne was sweating like pig. Her mouth was dry and she was white as a sheet. I said to her since you are so parched we need to get you something to drink and pulled into a drive thru and ordered a few ice coffees. I guess they may have got a glimpse of Daphne but by the look on her face you would have thought I had her laid out on the hood. As I pulled away I stopped for a minute and ran my hands over her cute little short shorts. Her clit was totally soft which told me I was getting the response I was looking for. This was for my enjoyment not hers."

I can say as a sub it is very difficult to describe exactly what kind of cruelty "does it" for me, but the last three sentences absolutely capture a very special type of cruelty that I have only experienced a couple of times in my life and reading this made me drift into subspace.

It's hard to describe and understand it but I think it's the mix of intense suffering under complete control... but hey, I'm not completely sure :)

15 comments:

  1. Hi Fur,
    I may have mentioned in previous reply to one of your blog updates about how my sissy Martina responded the first time i put her on her cb6000. I can honestly say that it was probably one of only two or three occasions since I collared Martina that she shed real tears from the mental turmoil she was going through at the time. She has shed tears associated with some painful punishments but those were due to the pain she was experiencing not the mental anguish.

    The first time i put her cb6000 on and told her in very plain cold way that as long as she was with me she would never experience another erection. She went crazy and told me to take it off i said ok but if i do we are finished she was to get out of my house and i did not want to see or hear from her again. At this point she totally broke down crying and calling me all sorts about what i had done to her and how she was in the predicament she was in. After a couple of minutes I asked if she still wanted me to take it off she said not if i want her to leave.

    To sum up cruelty is a necessary tool in any D/s relationship I do think it should be used carefully but when it is used it should be done brutally and with confidence until the required result has been achieved.

    Rfoj74…

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  2. Thank you for writing, Rfoj74.

    You did mention the basic idea of what happened in some earlier comments and I definitely appreciate you elaborating more upon them.

    That type of ultimatum is definitely effective in breaking a sub's will. It's not often that cruelty is wielded all that well. Your summary at the end is definitely sound advice.

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  3. Sorry, but I really wonder if it is good for a sub - no matter if sissified or not - to stay in a relationship where a Domme uses this kind of emotional blackmail. If she is willing to throw her submissive out of the house and never ever wants to have contact with him/her, just because one severe activity is too much for him/her... well, I don't see real affection or concern for sub's/sissie's wellbeing in such cases.

    It's really difficult to understand for me: What's the use of staying in a relationship like this? In a relationship where sub/sissi will be thrown away, ignored and forgotten, just because he/she has taboos and hard limits?

    - Debora -

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  4. I think it depends a bit on when and how the relationship started. For a D/s relationship that began vanilla and stayed that way for a long period of time before moving into the D/s realm, this abrupt and blunt approach is probably a bit harsh for the amount of emotional investment involved.

    For relationships that were founded on a D/s dynamic I think there's a bit more leeway in what the Dom/Domme can do to change the parameters as things develop. In every D/s relationship I've been in there have been constantly evolving rules and requirements made towards me and I've basically had to follow suit. Other times I've seen things like this used as a test early on to see if the sub is capable of handling the levels of domination that the Dom/Domme prefers. I do know this type of power-play can be abused but it's also tough to see where the line should be drawn (assuming it doesn't have emotionally damaging repercussions).

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  5. I agree with you about the leeway, but "she was to get out of my house and i did not want to see or hear from her again" sounds more than a bit more leeway. Even in D/s relationships there can be hard limits - especially in areas/activities which are quite intensive and difficult to endure. And I would say total chastity - "as long as she was with me she would never experience another erection" - falls into this category. I am not surprised that a sub has problems with this activity, I think most subs could not deal with that (chastity: yes, but not to such an extent).

    Let's imagine... If I were a submissive in this situation I would ask myself:
    'How valued can I feel in our relationship if my Domme has no problem to dump me only because something proves too much for me? She does not even want any further contact with me if I refuse to follow her order... No regret, no big emotions. Am I really that unimportant to her? Am I that easily replacable?'

    My big question: Why should a sub make such a big sacrifice against his will for his Domme, if she doesn't care about his limits and NoNos and if he is obviously not important to her? Why giving something important up if a Domme uses emotional blackmail as weapon? That does not make sense, in my opinion.
    'If she does not invest feelings in our relationship why should I? What value does our relationship have if she can thow me out of her house without batting an eyelash?'

    Don't get me wrong, if the whole relationship is NOT based on love or at least on friendship/sympathy and both are fulfilling only their roles as Domme and sub and nothing more... then it is somehow understandable that she acts in such a cold way. She wants to have her way, no matter what. That may not be considerate, but hey, she has no further responsibilities as partner, lover, friend...
    But it's hard to understand for me, why HE should cooperate in this situation. Is it emotional dependency? Or a subconscious yearning for this "special cruelty" you mentioned above?

    Well, and if the relationship HAS love or at least friendship as foundation then I find her coldness inappropriate. No matter if they started as vanillas or not. Not being the perfect match is one thing... but this radical attitude and wording is strange.

    - Debora -

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  6. >> I can say as a sub it is very difficult to describe exactly what kind of cruelty "does it" for me, but the last three sentences absolutely capture a very special type of cruelty that I have only experienced a couple of times in my life and reading this made me drift into subspace. <<

    Is this what you are seeking?

    This quote above sounds terrifying. Okay, at least for me.

    Clarance.

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  7. Debora, Thank you for writing.

    I think my views on it have a lot to do with my experiences courting as well as my friendships with Dommes other than the ones I have served.

    I think that a lot of Dominants tend to feel that personal relationship and love takes a back seat to the kink. I know this is true in all cases and many relationships of this nature will require love/connection, but it's a bit conditional.

    e.g. I would never expect an extreme sadist to even attempt a monogamous relationship with a sub that refuses to be spanked or whipped if it causes bruising or worse, even if they share a tremendous emotional bond and physical attraction. At best I could envision that Domme taking on multiple subs to ensure all needs are met.

    If the Dominant has certain specifics they KNOW they need their sub to adhere to I can completely understand making that statement early on in the relationship and the sub being given the choice of whether or not to adhere to it. I know Mistress Lori's sub (who makes the chastity tube) had a similar kind of prerequisite upon starting their relationship.

    IMO, the harder scenario happens during a long-standing D/s relationship and such a scenario is introduced. e.g. a D/s couple is married and has been doing the D/s thing for 5 years when she all of a sudden decides that he will be in permanent chastity or she is leaving him. This is a much tougher pill to swallow and even more unfair to the sub but at the same time, it's even more difficult for him to walk away. Sometimes this is more of a test/ultimatum and while it is quite fucked up emotionally, it can also serve to predict the likeliness of success together in the future.

    In courting my relationships (after my first one) I do pretty much feel replaceable. I'm not particularly attractive, I'm on the poorer side of the fence, there's a lot of activities that have no appeal to me, etc. I do know that I am somewhat intelligent, somewhat creative, funny, decent conversation, a variety of interests, am honest and trustworthy and so forth, etc. Basically, I hold a lot of great "friend" qualities but not necessarily what Dommes are looking for in a lover, especially in the short-run when it comes to kinky play.

    (I'm going to continue this in another post as I think I'm approaching the word limit).

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  8. Basically, I've always treated myself like I was replaceable. Most Dommes that have profiles on adult networking sites get flooded with 30+ emails a day so I know that there's always a dozen guys out there ready/willing/able to take my place at any time. This in turn makes me feel a bit desperate and I feel like I have to be willing to endure in order to stand out from the others... in order to appear like I am a better, more capable sub than the rest.

    This is also why I have relaxed most of the hard limits I once had.

    However... things get a bit more twisted in my own case. Being backed into a corner and forced to comply with something beyond my comfort level is a bit of a turn on for me and I could bear the bulk of it if I was certain that as long as I complied I would have security in the relationship. This probably speaks volumes about my level of emotional health

    Quote: "Well, and if the relationship HAS love or at least friendship as foundation then I find her coldness inappropriate. No matter if they started as vanillas or not. Not being the perfect match is one thing... but this radical attitude and wording is strange."

    I do think it was a bit on the extreme side but I think the true test of it would be to ask both parties if they have been happy since then and if they are glad that they made the decision to go along with things or not.

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  9. Clarence,

    The short answer is maybe.

    If surrounded by love and trust, yes.

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  10. Quote: 'I think that a lot of Dominants tend to feel that personal relationship and love takes a back seat to the kink. I know this is true in all cases and many relationships of this nature will require love/connection, but it's a bit conditional.'

    I agree with you that love/connection is conditional and I would even dare to say this is the case for nearly ALL people, no matter if dominant or not. Someone who loves so-called 'open relationships' will not feel comfortable in monogamous relationships, this person insists normally on sexual liberty. Someone who is into BDSM will usually not enter into a relationship with a vanilla. A vanilla has the condition 'but I will not do your kinky stuff!'. A sub who needs to be humilated will usually not seek a relationship with someone who is not into humilation play. A masochist has the condition 'I need you to inflict pain on me' or he/she will not be happy.

    And of course also a dom(me) has needs. If he/she wishes to keep someone is chastity (or to pursue other passions) and this need is really intense, it's understandable that this dominant insists in chastity - at least to a certain degree. And a sub who states that chastity is a nono or very hard limit will not be a good partner for this dominant.

    I was not saying that someone should neglect his or her own needs, if this needs are the cornerstone of his/her happiness. But the way the dom(me) expresses his/her rules, the shown attitude towards the sub, the wording, the willingness to give-and-take, etc. make the difference for me: Do I take sub's problems and doubts seriously? Am I willing to push his boundaries in a firm, but not reckless manner? Will I end this relationships if necessary without making an ugly scene? Or am I simply saying 'Obey or fuck off! Get out of my life!'?

    There is a elegant and fair way of expressing/ensuring that my needs have to be met and a bad and ugly way... ;)


    Quote: 'when she all of a sudden decides that he will be in permanent chastity or she is leaving him. This is a much tougher pill to swallow and even more unfair to the sub but at the same time, it's even more difficult for him to walk away. Sometimes this is more of a test/ultimatum and while it is quite fucked up emotionally, it can also serve to predict the likeliness of success together in the future.'

    I would not call this a 'success together'. It's more a success for HER. She was successful in blackmailing him emotionally and in forcing an unawanted harsh activity on him. (But again: It depends of course on the circumstances and the way she confronted him with her desire.)

    One would imagine that in a healthy, mutually beneficial relationship the dominant could find a better way than forcing him 'all of a sudden' to do sth. he cannot or does not want to endure without taking his needs and problems into consideration.


    Quote: 'Basically, I've always treated myself like I was replaceable.'

    Okay, I admit it's too easy for me to say: 'You should change this, do not not underprize yourself, don't see yourself as replacable' as I am not in the situation of having that much competitors... It's true, that there are more male subs than fem dommes. Finding a good sub is not always easy, but finding a good domme is much more difficult, I imagine.

    But nevertheless, despite this sub-problem: Your attitude is IMO dangerous. You may find yourself quickly in a situation where you give up more rights and limits than it is good for you...

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  11. (Sorry, today I am really challenging the word limit of your blog. I hope you don't mind my long posts? If yes, I will do my very best to be brief in the future. *g*)


    Quote: 'I do think it was a bit on the extreme side but I think the true test of it would be to ask both parties if they have been happy since then and if they are glad that they made the decision to go along with things or not.'

    Yes, and I hope Martinas answer (and the answer of other subs in similar dissicult situations) would be: 'Yes, I am happy, yes I learned to enjoy it.' ;)

    But in my view there is another true test concerning the quality of a relationship (by saying 'quality' I mean: is this a relationship based on mutual affection and responsibility? a relationship with the goal of mutual satisfaction?... other opinions may differ, but that is for ME quality).
    The test-question ist: What would the dominant say, if the submissive's answer would be 'no, I am not happy, permanent chastity affects me in a negative way, it's too hard and frustrating to endure this'? Would she say 'tough, that's not my concern'? Or would she show more understanding?

    I know this is theoretical and hypothetical, but in my view it is important, too. The problem is: If the sub learned to accept it, but the dominant would have required it anyway without showing any symathy, the sub's happy feelings would be based on pure luck. He is lucky that he learned to accept this activity, because if not, he would be forced to live an unfulfilling life with much frustration and little happiness. The domme would not relax her requirements, she would force him or dump him without mercy.
    And if she combines her harsh requirements with cold uncompromisingness and indifference for his feelings I cannot understand a submissive who chooses to stay, to trust her and to show her his love. He would live with someone, trust someone, love someone who does not care half as much for him as he for her. And who is willing to remove him immediately from her life.

    And this is sad.


    ~ Deborah ~

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  12. Deborah,

    no worries about the word limit. You are one of the few people that repeatedly post comments on my blog and I welcome your input.

    It is hard for me to reply to your comments because I think a lot of them are conditional on surrounding factors and it's easy to find cases on both sides of things. I'm also going to make several replies because I know I'll be pushing the word limit otherwise and my comments may be sort of all over the place.

    I wrote a reply on a different comment you left that is somewhat relevant here. I will copy/paste it here so for others that might be reading this can see it.

    From another comment I posted on a different entry:
    "Nine years ago I had a hard limit that I wouldn't let anything up my butt. 18 months ago I was emotionally blackmailed into a situation where I had to offer up something major to prove my devotion and I dropped that hard limit and let her violate me. It made me cry and I still cry every time it happens. It also turns me on a great deal and I go to a depth of subspace I had never reached before. In a healthier relationship that would have never happened but I do not regret it.

    Now no sexual contact with males is still a firm hard limit for me. If I was faced with the option of sucking off another man or having sex with one vs. having the relationship end I would walk without hesitation. It would hurt me that it came to that, but at that point it would leave me no other choice.

    I think ultimatums and emotional blackmail can put a sub into a position to where they must truly evaluate their hard limits and how important they are to them. Is it a need or a preference? With certain things I think that only under great duress are we willing to test the waters and find out or be willing to sacrifice everything to stand firm."

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  13. In regards to the other things... I would say I have never met a Domme that truly had no regard for her sub's feelings. I have met Dommes that display what I would call "Meta-love" (going from the idea of Meta-consent).

    They can act cruel or heartless towards their sub but deep down they cherish that the sub loves them and is in their life and willing to undergo her cruelty. They may not display love in a traditional way (they may show just the opposite) but they do love them in their own way. This kind of love is not enough for most people/subs to exist on, but there are subs out there wired for this kind of interaction.

    I know in my own case I have become more submissive as the years have passed. I have craved deeper domination, deeper cruelty... things that make my head spin and skin crawl at the thought of it. To put it bluntly I crave being pushed until I feel like I can barely handle it. If I found myself in permanent chastity (which I would not want), I would prefer it if she ignored, scorned/ridiculed, or even punished me for complaints.

    I do realize my more extreme D/s cravings are probably best worked out in roleplay as they tend to dance along the fantasy/too much to handle in reality line.

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  14. Quote: "Okay, I admit it's too easy for me to say: 'You should change this, do not not underprize yourself, don't see yourself as replacable' as I am not in the situation of having that much competitors... It's true, that there are more male subs than fem dommes. Finding a good sub is not always easy, but finding a good domme is much more difficult, I imagine."

    Sometimes it feels like scaling a mountain heh. I've found seeing myself as replaceable keeps me motivated to do my best. Seeing as I'm not overly attractive, rich, or well-hung I have to make my go as being dedicated, loving, and intelligent. I have done fairly well in courting and even had a few Dommes write to me first because of my profiles on adult networking sites (which is almost unheard of in our local scene). I had to do the same sort of compensation in vanilla dating as well by being kind, genuine, honest, caring, polite, funny, etc. Sadly, I have had much better luck in D/s dating than in vanilla dating (even before I had all these weird kinks and fetishes).

    Quote: "But nevertheless, despite this sub-problem: Your attitude is IMO dangerous. You may find yourself quickly in a situation where you give up more rights and limits than it is good for you... "

    It is very dangerous. My first Mistress warned me about that by a lot. At the same time some part of me wishes for a situation where I could give it all up.

    Most of the Dommes I have been with have gotten progressively more strict/dominant as things went on and in turn, I have grown to crave more strict/dominant women than before.

    I have also grown content with roleplaying the more extreme scenarios and keeping the D/s more casual.

    I can say that I am a fairly emotionally damaged person and that has a great deal of impact on things.

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